How about this camera?

Our Eye's under the water.
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rehoward
Posts: 49
Joined: Dec 15th, 2015, 5:41 am
Location: Everett, WA

How about this camera?

Post by rehoward »

Hi all, new guy here. I have been researching web sites and forums lately learning about how I might build an ROV. Right now I am looking at cameras.

I found this camera and it seems interesting because of low cost, low light abilities, and a 90 degree viewing angle: http://www.supercircuits.com/700-tvl-da ... ns-pc600xp I am wondering about image distortion from any fish-eye effect and also what the depth of field might be? I assume DOF is infinite at distance with this lens but what would be the near focusing ability be in inches? The camera would have its power on-board within the ROV.

And that brings up what sort of cable might be used for a tether. I have found Cat5 direct burial cable that for transmission accuracy is limited to about 100 meters. And I read an article on Ethernet cable (whatever that is) good for a mile or more. And then another web site claims UTP twisted pair copper cable is good for 330 meters, but I don't know yet if it can be bought in a weatherized version. And finally, I found these devices for termination of the UTP cable but I am not sure if they are just fancy wire connectors or what: http://www.cctvcamerapros.com/CCTV-Balun-p/vb-2vs.htm.

The rest of the ROV will include3-5 thrusters most likely based on brushless DC motors. An Arduino will provide control communication to both top-side operator and ROV machinery. This setup will require ESC's for the motors and some sort of Arduino interface to the ESC’s which I haven't figured out yet. Batteries may be LiFePO4 for safety and long life. But I have not priced these yet and do not know of their availability. A cheap battery to use would be a glass mat lead/acid battery but they are large and much heavier and I am not sure yet if they will work with the usual ESC’s on the market. At any rate the controls tether for these items will probably share the same challenges as the tether fro the camera, yes? Or maybe one cable can provide all the conductors I need? That would be cool.

So as you can see I have lots of questions regarding a camera, tethers and cable, and also control add-ons for the Arduino board. Maybe someone could take the time to help me get started with answers to these key questions? Thanks.

Randy
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sthone
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Re: How about this camera?

Post by sthone »

I recently bought the PC600XS with the standard lens but I haven't had a chance to fully test it yet. When I do though I will let you know.

As for the baluns I have tried a few and they do work. Some of them don't even require all of the wires in a cat5 cable so you can (in theory) transmit your control signals over the same cable.

-Steve :sting:
rehoward
Posts: 49
Joined: Dec 15th, 2015, 5:41 am
Location: Everett, WA

Re: How about this camera?

Post by rehoward »

sthone wrote:I recently bought the PC600XS with the standard lens but I haven't had a chance to fully test it yet. When I do though I will let you know.

As for the baluns I have tried a few and they do work. Some of them don't even require all of the wires in a cat5 cable so you can (in theory) transmit your control signals over the same cable.

-Steve :sting:
How did the PC600XS work out for you? I got the PC600XP up and running on an old LCD computer monitor and it was pretty good I thought. There was a lot of graininess in the image but color was good, depth of field good, and a slight distortion because of the fisheye view. All in all for $20 I can't complain. I need to get it submerged and see how usable it really is.

How did testing with the PC600XS go?

Randy

PS - What does XP and XS mean? Is the XP analog and the XS digital maybe?
Mgbss
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Joined: Jul 15th, 2011, 9:53 am

Re: How about this camera?

Post by Mgbss »

Randy

I have tried a few cameras in my rov and find that any camera you pick that will work with your system will be fine
After you have your Rov up and running, you can then try to find a camera that would be better after you know what to improve on. The fact is you will be setting focus to about 6" to 1 foot and underwater to see 20 ft is unusual.

I have found that you want a lightweight tether our rov are not all that powerfull and a heavy tether just causes drag or can even pull them down.
rehoward
Posts: 49
Joined: Dec 15th, 2015, 5:41 am
Location: Everett, WA

Re: How about this camera?

Post by rehoward »

Mgbss wrote:Randy

I have tried a few cameras in my rov and find that any camera you pick that will work with your system will be fine
After you have your Rov up and running, you can then try to find a camera that would be better after you know what to improve on. The fact is you will be setting focus to about 6" to 1 foot and underwater to see 20 ft is unusual.

I have found that you want a lightweight tether our rov are not all that powerfull and a heavy tether just causes drag or can even pull them down.
The camera I bought is working out pretty well. It has very good resolution especially as close as 3" away from the lens. Further distance and it gets increasingly grainy but still very usable. Low light is very good but without light colors disappear. I am now looking for a source of high intensity LED's so I can build a bright array for the cam. I want to build a circular array and position it around the lens and it should be able to be 12VDC powered. I think this camera could rock as it is cheap and small with great low light gathering. Anyone please respond with ideas on LED's.

Randy
Mgbss
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Joined: Jul 15th, 2011, 9:53 am

Re: How about this camera?

Post by Mgbss »

Are you thinking your going to put the LED s around the lens?
I have often wondered if that would work surveillance cameras get away with it but I always thought you would get reflection from the ROV s dome or end cap
Anyway if that is what you are looking for I have seen them on Fleabay

My present RoV I am using 12v LED pond lights and they have gotten me by but not the brightest, I am in the process of building new ones out of 12v track light bulbs enclosed in PVC
rehoward
Posts: 49
Joined: Dec 15th, 2015, 5:41 am
Location: Everett, WA

Re: How about this camera?

Post by rehoward »

Mgbss wrote:Are you thinking your going to put the LED s around the lens?
I have often wondered if that would work surveillance cameras get away with it but I always thought you would get reflection from the ROV s dome or end cap
Anyway if that is what you are looking for I have seen them on Fleabay

My present RoV I am using 12v LED pond lights and they have gotten me by but not the brightest, I am in the process of building new ones out of 12v track light bulbs enclosed in PVC
I am looking for a 12VDC string of high intensity LED lights that I can array around the camera lens. I have the camera set up in my living room and have experimented with light intrusion using a cheap Harbor Freight LED flashlight. The cam is very insensitive to stray light from the flashlight up to a certain and easily defined viewing angle. I want to move on with making an LED ring, similar to what is sold for big $$$ to professional photographers. Should not be that hard.

Randy
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sthone
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Re: How about this camera?

Post by sthone »

rehoward wrote:How did the PC600XS work out for you? I got the PC600XP up and running on an old LCD computer monitor and it was pretty good I thought. There was a lot of graininess in the image but color was good, depth of field good, and a slight distortion because of the fisheye view. All in all for $20 I can't complain. I need to get it submerged and see how usable it really is.

How did testing with the PC600XS go?

Randy

PS - What does XP and XS mean? Is the XP analog and the XS digital maybe?
I still haven't tested it out and by that I mean in the water... (which is the only true test.) Yes I've plugged it into the TV and it seems like an OK camera. When it's in color mode (full lighting) the picture looks pretty good but with the lights off and it switches to B/W the image does look grainy. When I compare it to the camera I use on my Seafox the image looks very similar (still grainy) out of the water but I know when my Seafox is in the water I have a pretty good image on screen so I have some high hopes for this camera.

The thing you have to keep in mind is out of the water you're looking at a much great depth of field were as once your in the water you only can see a few feet. This goes for lighting too... anything you test out of the water is going to be completely different in the water so don't rely to much on out of the water testing.

As for the XP vs XS... I'm guessing but I think the camera is the same it's just the lens thats different. P = Pinhole Lens & S = Standard.

-Steve
rehoward
Posts: 49
Joined: Dec 15th, 2015, 5:41 am
Location: Everett, WA

Re: How about this camera?

Post by rehoward »

sthone wrote:
rehoward wrote:How did the PC600XS work out for you? I got the PC600XP up and running on an old LCD computer monitor and it was pretty good I thought. There was a lot of graininess in the image but color was good, depth of field good, and a slight distortion because of the fisheye view. All in all for $20 I can't complain. I need to get it submerged and see how usable it really is.

How did testing with the PC600XS go?

Randy

PS - What does XP and XS mean? Is the XP analog and the XS digital maybe?
I still haven't tested it out and by that I mean in the water... (which is the only true test.) Yes I've plugged it into the TV and it seems like an OK camera. When it's in color mode (full lighting) the picture looks pretty good but with the lights off and it switches to B/W the image does look grainy. When I compare it to the camera I use on my Seafox the image looks very similar (still grainy) out of the water but I know when my Seafox is in the water I have a pretty good image on screen so I have some high hopes for this camera.

The thing you have to keep in mind is out of the water you're looking at a much great depth of field were as once your in the water you only can see a few feet. This goes for lighting too... anything you test out of the water is going to be completely different in the water so don't rely to much on out of the water testing.

As for the XP vs XS... I'm guessing but I think the camera is the same it's just the lens thats different. P = Pinhole Lens & S = Standard.

-Steve

Thanks Steve.

I have been experimenting with a $20 Sony cam that I bought from Supercircuits.com. It is a pinhole cam but it has decent resolution and great low light specs, .0001 LUX rating. I have it set up in my living room and even at night with all house lights off except the kitchen light (kitchen light is many feet away and blocked by two doorways) it still produces a recognizable image.

I have the output wired to an old 15"computer LCD screen and for 48 hours it produced an acceptable image. Then something changed, I don't know what. It now produces a good image for maybe 3 hours. Then the display goes black and starts this weird thing where it begins to show the camera image starting vertically, in the middle of the screen, and then progresses outward both left and right. Then poof no image and it starts over again. I haven't been able to figure out if it is the cam or the interface module that allowed me to put the video out into my monitor.

The module is this one:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001VL ... ge_o00_s01

Camera is this one:
http://www.supercircuits.com/700-tvl-da ... ns-pc600xp

It produces a composite video in signal.

Maybe you have some trouble shooting ideas?

Randy
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